Nose gear failure in single prop aircraft: belly landing or nose landing? Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara Planned maintenance scheduled April 23, 2019 at 23:30 UTC (7:30pm US/Eastern)When do pilots deploy landing gear?How does the landing gear damp vibrations?Why don't modern aircraft have landing gear that can swivel to compensate for crosswinds?Is it possible to control an aircraft on the runway if the nose gear collapses?Which is the technically correct term: Nose Gear or Nose Landing Gear?Does it make sense to do an emergency landing without nose gear in order to reduce stopping distance?Is it better to shut down the engine(s) or leave it (them) running when a gear up landing is imminent?Is there a landing gear system that extends automatically to prevent belly landing?Should an emergency field landing be performed with landing gear down or up?Landing gear sequence
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Nose gear failure in single prop aircraft: belly landing or nose landing?
Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara
Planned maintenance scheduled April 23, 2019 at 23:30 UTC (7:30pm US/Eastern)When do pilots deploy landing gear?How does the landing gear damp vibrations?Why don't modern aircraft have landing gear that can swivel to compensate for crosswinds?Is it possible to control an aircraft on the runway if the nose gear collapses?Which is the technically correct term: Nose Gear or Nose Landing Gear?Does it make sense to do an emergency landing without nose gear in order to reduce stopping distance?Is it better to shut down the engine(s) or leave it (them) running when a gear up landing is imminent?Is there a landing gear system that extends automatically to prevent belly landing?Should an emergency field landing be performed with landing gear down or up?Landing gear sequence
$begingroup$
Let's say we are flying a single prop airplane with tricycle format retractable gear, such as a Mooney Bravo or a Piper Comache. The nose gear fails mid-flight and is unable to be lowered. Is it safer to attempt a belly landing, or to actually try and make use of the functional main landing gear? What is the standard procedure?
Edits and updates:
- Here is the video of a very smooth looking nose landing with a RCMP Pilatus PC-12 I could find
- Here is the video of a smooth looking belly landing find I could find
My major concern with the nose landing would be the increased risk of the nose digging in, causing a flip and/or the fuselage to break in half. As pointed out by @acpilot, the probability of this increases according to runway type.
landing landing-gear emergency-procedures failures
New contributor
naco is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
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$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Let's say we are flying a single prop airplane with tricycle format retractable gear, such as a Mooney Bravo or a Piper Comache. The nose gear fails mid-flight and is unable to be lowered. Is it safer to attempt a belly landing, or to actually try and make use of the functional main landing gear? What is the standard procedure?
Edits and updates:
- Here is the video of a very smooth looking nose landing with a RCMP Pilatus PC-12 I could find
- Here is the video of a smooth looking belly landing find I could find
My major concern with the nose landing would be the increased risk of the nose digging in, causing a flip and/or the fuselage to break in half. As pointed out by @acpilot, the probability of this increases according to runway type.
landing landing-gear emergency-procedures failures
New contributor
naco is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
$endgroup$
1
$begingroup$
There is no procedure that this situation has, so this may be entirely opinion based. Personally I'd leave the mains down and land on the nose. Gives better directional control at lower speeds and you don't have to replace as much skin/antennas when the repair bill comes around (but you will need a new prop/motor anyway). Especially for low-wing aircraft though because things like flaps hang below the aircraft and you can really tear up a lot in a belly landing.
$endgroup$
– Ron Beyer
2 days ago
1
$begingroup$
Keep the fuel away from sparks. Then avoid sudden deceleration. So, if landing on other than hard surfaces, you may need to consider the chances of burying the nose and flipping. Personally, I'd leave my mains down and fly the nose on to a paved surface. Repair bills aren't part of my thought process. That's what insurance is for.
$endgroup$
– acpilot
2 days ago
1
$begingroup$
One the gear or engine fails, the insurer owns the airplane, and your only job as pilot is to limit injuries to yourself (and any passengers) as best you can.
$endgroup$
– StephenS
yesterday
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Let's say we are flying a single prop airplane with tricycle format retractable gear, such as a Mooney Bravo or a Piper Comache. The nose gear fails mid-flight and is unable to be lowered. Is it safer to attempt a belly landing, or to actually try and make use of the functional main landing gear? What is the standard procedure?
Edits and updates:
- Here is the video of a very smooth looking nose landing with a RCMP Pilatus PC-12 I could find
- Here is the video of a smooth looking belly landing find I could find
My major concern with the nose landing would be the increased risk of the nose digging in, causing a flip and/or the fuselage to break in half. As pointed out by @acpilot, the probability of this increases according to runway type.
landing landing-gear emergency-procedures failures
New contributor
naco is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
$endgroup$
Let's say we are flying a single prop airplane with tricycle format retractable gear, such as a Mooney Bravo or a Piper Comache. The nose gear fails mid-flight and is unable to be lowered. Is it safer to attempt a belly landing, or to actually try and make use of the functional main landing gear? What is the standard procedure?
Edits and updates:
- Here is the video of a very smooth looking nose landing with a RCMP Pilatus PC-12 I could find
- Here is the video of a smooth looking belly landing find I could find
My major concern with the nose landing would be the increased risk of the nose digging in, causing a flip and/or the fuselage to break in half. As pointed out by @acpilot, the probability of this increases according to runway type.
landing landing-gear emergency-procedures failures
landing landing-gear emergency-procedures failures
New contributor
naco is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
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edited yesterday
naco
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asked 2 days ago
naconaco
315
315
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Check out our Code of Conduct.
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Check out our Code of Conduct.
1
$begingroup$
There is no procedure that this situation has, so this may be entirely opinion based. Personally I'd leave the mains down and land on the nose. Gives better directional control at lower speeds and you don't have to replace as much skin/antennas when the repair bill comes around (but you will need a new prop/motor anyway). Especially for low-wing aircraft though because things like flaps hang below the aircraft and you can really tear up a lot in a belly landing.
$endgroup$
– Ron Beyer
2 days ago
1
$begingroup$
Keep the fuel away from sparks. Then avoid sudden deceleration. So, if landing on other than hard surfaces, you may need to consider the chances of burying the nose and flipping. Personally, I'd leave my mains down and fly the nose on to a paved surface. Repair bills aren't part of my thought process. That's what insurance is for.
$endgroup$
– acpilot
2 days ago
1
$begingroup$
One the gear or engine fails, the insurer owns the airplane, and your only job as pilot is to limit injuries to yourself (and any passengers) as best you can.
$endgroup$
– StephenS
yesterday
add a comment |
1
$begingroup$
There is no procedure that this situation has, so this may be entirely opinion based. Personally I'd leave the mains down and land on the nose. Gives better directional control at lower speeds and you don't have to replace as much skin/antennas when the repair bill comes around (but you will need a new prop/motor anyway). Especially for low-wing aircraft though because things like flaps hang below the aircraft and you can really tear up a lot in a belly landing.
$endgroup$
– Ron Beyer
2 days ago
1
$begingroup$
Keep the fuel away from sparks. Then avoid sudden deceleration. So, if landing on other than hard surfaces, you may need to consider the chances of burying the nose and flipping. Personally, I'd leave my mains down and fly the nose on to a paved surface. Repair bills aren't part of my thought process. That's what insurance is for.
$endgroup$
– acpilot
2 days ago
1
$begingroup$
One the gear or engine fails, the insurer owns the airplane, and your only job as pilot is to limit injuries to yourself (and any passengers) as best you can.
$endgroup$
– StephenS
yesterday
1
1
$begingroup$
There is no procedure that this situation has, so this may be entirely opinion based. Personally I'd leave the mains down and land on the nose. Gives better directional control at lower speeds and you don't have to replace as much skin/antennas when the repair bill comes around (but you will need a new prop/motor anyway). Especially for low-wing aircraft though because things like flaps hang below the aircraft and you can really tear up a lot in a belly landing.
$endgroup$
– Ron Beyer
2 days ago
$begingroup$
There is no procedure that this situation has, so this may be entirely opinion based. Personally I'd leave the mains down and land on the nose. Gives better directional control at lower speeds and you don't have to replace as much skin/antennas when the repair bill comes around (but you will need a new prop/motor anyway). Especially for low-wing aircraft though because things like flaps hang below the aircraft and you can really tear up a lot in a belly landing.
$endgroup$
– Ron Beyer
2 days ago
1
1
$begingroup$
Keep the fuel away from sparks. Then avoid sudden deceleration. So, if landing on other than hard surfaces, you may need to consider the chances of burying the nose and flipping. Personally, I'd leave my mains down and fly the nose on to a paved surface. Repair bills aren't part of my thought process. That's what insurance is for.
$endgroup$
– acpilot
2 days ago
$begingroup$
Keep the fuel away from sparks. Then avoid sudden deceleration. So, if landing on other than hard surfaces, you may need to consider the chances of burying the nose and flipping. Personally, I'd leave my mains down and fly the nose on to a paved surface. Repair bills aren't part of my thought process. That's what insurance is for.
$endgroup$
– acpilot
2 days ago
1
1
$begingroup$
One the gear or engine fails, the insurer owns the airplane, and your only job as pilot is to limit injuries to yourself (and any passengers) as best you can.
$endgroup$
– StephenS
yesterday
$begingroup$
One the gear or engine fails, the insurer owns the airplane, and your only job as pilot is to limit injuries to yourself (and any passengers) as best you can.
$endgroup$
– StephenS
yesterday
add a comment |
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
The standard procedure is whatever is in the POH for your aircraft. This is from a C182RG POH:
LANDING WITH A DEFECTIVE NOSE GEAR (Or Flat Nose Tire)
- Movable Load -- TRANSFER to baggage area.
- Passenger -- MOVE to rear seat.
- Before Landing Checklist -- COMPLETE.
- Runway -- HARD SURFACE or SMOOTH SOD
- Wing Flaps -- 40°
- Cabin Doors -- UNLATCH PRIOR TO TOUCHDOWN.
- Avionics Power and Master Switches -- OFF when landing is assured.
- Land -- SLIGHTLY TAIL LOW.
- Mixture -- IDLE CUT-OFF.
- Ignition Switch -- OFF.
- Fuel Selector Valve -- OFF.
- Elevator Control -- HOLD NOSE OFF GROUND as long as possible.
- Airplane -- EVACUATE as soon as it stops.
That assumes that you've already run the gear extension failure checklist without success, of course.
$endgroup$
2
$begingroup$
I really like the "Hold nose off ground as long as possible" recommendation. I usually hear "lower the nose gently", which is obvious, but having a non-arbitrary rule on when to actually put it down should definitely help.
$endgroup$
– naco
2 days ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Typically in that situation, you would land with the gear down and lower the nose as gently to the ground as possible after touchdown. Nose gear failures are the easiest of all gear up
landings to deal with.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
While technically not one of the choices you asked about, you may not be aware of a quasi-third option you should consider.
Make a pass down the runway and "bang it on the mains" a couple of times to see if you can jolt the nose gear to go down and locked. If it works, go around WITHOUT RAISING THE GEAR and land normally (well, more like gingerly). Even if it doesn't work, you are no worse off than you started and this has the added benefit of burning off a pattern's worth of fuel (you'll want to burn fuel down to minimum reserves before committing to a landing to minimize stall speed and fire danger regardless) and gives you a look at the texture of the surface to help you with your original choice.
Additionally, if you do wind up landing without (nose|any) gear down, if the engine stops when you switch it off (not a given), try to position the propeller with a couple of bumps with the starter before touching it down such that is positioned to minimize contact with the ground to reduce the likelihood of digging in and flipping, as well as reduce the repair/inspection bill on the engine itself.
New contributor
Bob is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
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add a comment |
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3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
The standard procedure is whatever is in the POH for your aircraft. This is from a C182RG POH:
LANDING WITH A DEFECTIVE NOSE GEAR (Or Flat Nose Tire)
- Movable Load -- TRANSFER to baggage area.
- Passenger -- MOVE to rear seat.
- Before Landing Checklist -- COMPLETE.
- Runway -- HARD SURFACE or SMOOTH SOD
- Wing Flaps -- 40°
- Cabin Doors -- UNLATCH PRIOR TO TOUCHDOWN.
- Avionics Power and Master Switches -- OFF when landing is assured.
- Land -- SLIGHTLY TAIL LOW.
- Mixture -- IDLE CUT-OFF.
- Ignition Switch -- OFF.
- Fuel Selector Valve -- OFF.
- Elevator Control -- HOLD NOSE OFF GROUND as long as possible.
- Airplane -- EVACUATE as soon as it stops.
That assumes that you've already run the gear extension failure checklist without success, of course.
$endgroup$
2
$begingroup$
I really like the "Hold nose off ground as long as possible" recommendation. I usually hear "lower the nose gently", which is obvious, but having a non-arbitrary rule on when to actually put it down should definitely help.
$endgroup$
– naco
2 days ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The standard procedure is whatever is in the POH for your aircraft. This is from a C182RG POH:
LANDING WITH A DEFECTIVE NOSE GEAR (Or Flat Nose Tire)
- Movable Load -- TRANSFER to baggage area.
- Passenger -- MOVE to rear seat.
- Before Landing Checklist -- COMPLETE.
- Runway -- HARD SURFACE or SMOOTH SOD
- Wing Flaps -- 40°
- Cabin Doors -- UNLATCH PRIOR TO TOUCHDOWN.
- Avionics Power and Master Switches -- OFF when landing is assured.
- Land -- SLIGHTLY TAIL LOW.
- Mixture -- IDLE CUT-OFF.
- Ignition Switch -- OFF.
- Fuel Selector Valve -- OFF.
- Elevator Control -- HOLD NOSE OFF GROUND as long as possible.
- Airplane -- EVACUATE as soon as it stops.
That assumes that you've already run the gear extension failure checklist without success, of course.
$endgroup$
2
$begingroup$
I really like the "Hold nose off ground as long as possible" recommendation. I usually hear "lower the nose gently", which is obvious, but having a non-arbitrary rule on when to actually put it down should definitely help.
$endgroup$
– naco
2 days ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The standard procedure is whatever is in the POH for your aircraft. This is from a C182RG POH:
LANDING WITH A DEFECTIVE NOSE GEAR (Or Flat Nose Tire)
- Movable Load -- TRANSFER to baggage area.
- Passenger -- MOVE to rear seat.
- Before Landing Checklist -- COMPLETE.
- Runway -- HARD SURFACE or SMOOTH SOD
- Wing Flaps -- 40°
- Cabin Doors -- UNLATCH PRIOR TO TOUCHDOWN.
- Avionics Power and Master Switches -- OFF when landing is assured.
- Land -- SLIGHTLY TAIL LOW.
- Mixture -- IDLE CUT-OFF.
- Ignition Switch -- OFF.
- Fuel Selector Valve -- OFF.
- Elevator Control -- HOLD NOSE OFF GROUND as long as possible.
- Airplane -- EVACUATE as soon as it stops.
That assumes that you've already run the gear extension failure checklist without success, of course.
$endgroup$
The standard procedure is whatever is in the POH for your aircraft. This is from a C182RG POH:
LANDING WITH A DEFECTIVE NOSE GEAR (Or Flat Nose Tire)
- Movable Load -- TRANSFER to baggage area.
- Passenger -- MOVE to rear seat.
- Before Landing Checklist -- COMPLETE.
- Runway -- HARD SURFACE or SMOOTH SOD
- Wing Flaps -- 40°
- Cabin Doors -- UNLATCH PRIOR TO TOUCHDOWN.
- Avionics Power and Master Switches -- OFF when landing is assured.
- Land -- SLIGHTLY TAIL LOW.
- Mixture -- IDLE CUT-OFF.
- Ignition Switch -- OFF.
- Fuel Selector Valve -- OFF.
- Elevator Control -- HOLD NOSE OFF GROUND as long as possible.
- Airplane -- EVACUATE as soon as it stops.
That assumes that you've already run the gear extension failure checklist without success, of course.
answered 2 days ago
PondlifePondlife
52.5k10143293
52.5k10143293
2
$begingroup$
I really like the "Hold nose off ground as long as possible" recommendation. I usually hear "lower the nose gently", which is obvious, but having a non-arbitrary rule on when to actually put it down should definitely help.
$endgroup$
– naco
2 days ago
add a comment |
2
$begingroup$
I really like the "Hold nose off ground as long as possible" recommendation. I usually hear "lower the nose gently", which is obvious, but having a non-arbitrary rule on when to actually put it down should definitely help.
$endgroup$
– naco
2 days ago
2
2
$begingroup$
I really like the "Hold nose off ground as long as possible" recommendation. I usually hear "lower the nose gently", which is obvious, but having a non-arbitrary rule on when to actually put it down should definitely help.
$endgroup$
– naco
2 days ago
$begingroup$
I really like the "Hold nose off ground as long as possible" recommendation. I usually hear "lower the nose gently", which is obvious, but having a non-arbitrary rule on when to actually put it down should definitely help.
$endgroup$
– naco
2 days ago
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Typically in that situation, you would land with the gear down and lower the nose as gently to the ground as possible after touchdown. Nose gear failures are the easiest of all gear up
landings to deal with.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Typically in that situation, you would land with the gear down and lower the nose as gently to the ground as possible after touchdown. Nose gear failures are the easiest of all gear up
landings to deal with.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Typically in that situation, you would land with the gear down and lower the nose as gently to the ground as possible after touchdown. Nose gear failures are the easiest of all gear up
landings to deal with.
$endgroup$
Typically in that situation, you would land with the gear down and lower the nose as gently to the ground as possible after touchdown. Nose gear failures are the easiest of all gear up
landings to deal with.
answered 2 days ago
Carlo FelicioneCarlo Felicione
43.7k480159
43.7k480159
add a comment |
add a comment |
$begingroup$
While technically not one of the choices you asked about, you may not be aware of a quasi-third option you should consider.
Make a pass down the runway and "bang it on the mains" a couple of times to see if you can jolt the nose gear to go down and locked. If it works, go around WITHOUT RAISING THE GEAR and land normally (well, more like gingerly). Even if it doesn't work, you are no worse off than you started and this has the added benefit of burning off a pattern's worth of fuel (you'll want to burn fuel down to minimum reserves before committing to a landing to minimize stall speed and fire danger regardless) and gives you a look at the texture of the surface to help you with your original choice.
Additionally, if you do wind up landing without (nose|any) gear down, if the engine stops when you switch it off (not a given), try to position the propeller with a couple of bumps with the starter before touching it down such that is positioned to minimize contact with the ground to reduce the likelihood of digging in and flipping, as well as reduce the repair/inspection bill on the engine itself.
New contributor
Bob is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
While technically not one of the choices you asked about, you may not be aware of a quasi-third option you should consider.
Make a pass down the runway and "bang it on the mains" a couple of times to see if you can jolt the nose gear to go down and locked. If it works, go around WITHOUT RAISING THE GEAR and land normally (well, more like gingerly). Even if it doesn't work, you are no worse off than you started and this has the added benefit of burning off a pattern's worth of fuel (you'll want to burn fuel down to minimum reserves before committing to a landing to minimize stall speed and fire danger regardless) and gives you a look at the texture of the surface to help you with your original choice.
Additionally, if you do wind up landing without (nose|any) gear down, if the engine stops when you switch it off (not a given), try to position the propeller with a couple of bumps with the starter before touching it down such that is positioned to minimize contact with the ground to reduce the likelihood of digging in and flipping, as well as reduce the repair/inspection bill on the engine itself.
New contributor
Bob is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
While technically not one of the choices you asked about, you may not be aware of a quasi-third option you should consider.
Make a pass down the runway and "bang it on the mains" a couple of times to see if you can jolt the nose gear to go down and locked. If it works, go around WITHOUT RAISING THE GEAR and land normally (well, more like gingerly). Even if it doesn't work, you are no worse off than you started and this has the added benefit of burning off a pattern's worth of fuel (you'll want to burn fuel down to minimum reserves before committing to a landing to minimize stall speed and fire danger regardless) and gives you a look at the texture of the surface to help you with your original choice.
Additionally, if you do wind up landing without (nose|any) gear down, if the engine stops when you switch it off (not a given), try to position the propeller with a couple of bumps with the starter before touching it down such that is positioned to minimize contact with the ground to reduce the likelihood of digging in and flipping, as well as reduce the repair/inspection bill on the engine itself.
New contributor
Bob is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
$endgroup$
While technically not one of the choices you asked about, you may not be aware of a quasi-third option you should consider.
Make a pass down the runway and "bang it on the mains" a couple of times to see if you can jolt the nose gear to go down and locked. If it works, go around WITHOUT RAISING THE GEAR and land normally (well, more like gingerly). Even if it doesn't work, you are no worse off than you started and this has the added benefit of burning off a pattern's worth of fuel (you'll want to burn fuel down to minimum reserves before committing to a landing to minimize stall speed and fire danger regardless) and gives you a look at the texture of the surface to help you with your original choice.
Additionally, if you do wind up landing without (nose|any) gear down, if the engine stops when you switch it off (not a given), try to position the propeller with a couple of bumps with the starter before touching it down such that is positioned to minimize contact with the ground to reduce the likelihood of digging in and flipping, as well as reduce the repair/inspection bill on the engine itself.
New contributor
Bob is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
New contributor
Bob is a new contributor to this site. Take care in asking for clarification, commenting, and answering.
Check out our Code of Conduct.
answered yesterday
BobBob
1411
1411
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add a comment |
add a comment |
naco is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
naco is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
naco is a new contributor. Be nice, and check out our Code of Conduct.
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1
$begingroup$
There is no procedure that this situation has, so this may be entirely opinion based. Personally I'd leave the mains down and land on the nose. Gives better directional control at lower speeds and you don't have to replace as much skin/antennas when the repair bill comes around (but you will need a new prop/motor anyway). Especially for low-wing aircraft though because things like flaps hang below the aircraft and you can really tear up a lot in a belly landing.
$endgroup$
– Ron Beyer
2 days ago
1
$begingroup$
Keep the fuel away from sparks. Then avoid sudden deceleration. So, if landing on other than hard surfaces, you may need to consider the chances of burying the nose and flipping. Personally, I'd leave my mains down and fly the nose on to a paved surface. Repair bills aren't part of my thought process. That's what insurance is for.
$endgroup$
– acpilot
2 days ago
1
$begingroup$
One the gear or engine fails, the insurer owns the airplane, and your only job as pilot is to limit injuries to yourself (and any passengers) as best you can.
$endgroup$
– StephenS
yesterday